Ekbom’s Syndrome Delusional Parasitosis Delusions of infestation the belief that you are infested


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hi everybody frank the pest geek here and welcome to the pest geek podcast bringing
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business hey welcome back welcome back to the
pestgeek podcast I am your host Frank Hernandez and we’re going to be
discussing Ekboms syndrome known as delusional parasitosis or delusions of
infestation now this is one of those podcasts that is going to be very
sensitive because if you’re a technician you will inevitably run into one of
these cases and I’ve already had two or three of them they’re not widespread but
it is a problem that every technician is going to run into it I’m gonna give you
my experience on a couple of these that I run into in the last 13 years of doing
this and it could be very challenging for the technician as well as the
customer who’s who’s suffering from this and it really is taxing on the
technician when he does run into one of these situations a lot of the time you
know you have a salesperson that went out and made a sale on something that
was there and and it happens in our industry unfortunately commission sales
people get paid to make sales they don’t make get paid to make real
diagnosis or identification or problems a lot of the time and basically they’re
going door to door you know hey and the person says yeah I have this problem and
they sign him up and the technician goes to do the job and the technician can’t
find an insect to save their life to solve this problem and he finds out he’s
dealing with something outside of his realm of expertise and his realm of
something that he’s never run into before that he’s challenged with and he
does not know how to handle this and you know I’ve dealt with a lot of things
in my life I realize what I’m talking to somebody you know based on you know 50
years of being on this earth of dealing with people and understanding when
something in the conversation isn’t right and I normally get the phone call
you know I’ll get the phone call of the person telling me they’re suffering from
a past problem and it’s usually that they’re biting them and again we’re
gonna learn how we’re going to basically deal with this because everyone in this
industry is eventually gonna run into this I mean it’s just a matter of time
before you you run into this I mean right now the statistics from the CDC
and other reporting agencies basically say that it’s probably you know six
people in in about a hundred thousand you know so it’s not widespread so this
is why there’s not a lot of talk about this but it is a very serious condition
that has been going on for way over a hundred years since it was first
described from 1902 just to give you a little bit of history on this from 1902
to 1938 case is describing parasitic OBS or dermatological hiber hypo conned
racist country Isis this is what it was described as during that time then after
1938 a a doctor by the name of Karl axel egg bomb in 1938 describes it
delusion of parasitic infestations and associated with tactical hallucinations
as well as skin manifestations where present were present in postmenopausal
women so this is you know it is documented you can look this up it’s
documented in in in a Diana in an article written by dr. egg bomb called
the called a pre senile delusion of infestation history of psychic
psychiatry so this is it could be one of two things
you’re right or dealing with a person who is having a psychiatric or
psychological problem or you’re dealing with a person that’s having a
dermatological problem and the problem that we have with this issue when we run
up against it is that we’re neither medical doctors nor are we
psychiatrist nor are we therapists we’re not licensed to diagnose any of these
issues and when you can’t you got to be really sensitive because you’re you’re
dealing with a problem that you’re looking for a pest that most likely is
not there and as pest control experts as pest control people technicians we can
only deal and treat a pest problem when the pest problem is there we’re not
authorized to treat people we can’t treat pests on the skin that’s a medical
problem and there are insects that you infest the skin but however those are
not entomological those have to be treated by a doctor and we’re not
authorized to do that and we’re not authorized to be inspecting people skin
and touching people and think let me see what you have and
it’s you you there are gray lines there in our industry that we somehow cannot
cross and I I will get I’ve gotten the call where the person I remember my
first call and I’ll talk to you about that one a person calls me and say
listen hi I got your number from so-and-so that told me to give you a
call cuz you can help me with this I’m having an issue of an insect that’s
biting me and I said okay you know you’re getting bites from instinct
that’s not uncommon we get calls like that all the time people getting bitten
in you’re getting bitten by fleas they’re getting bitten by noseeums
they’re getting bit by mosquitoes they’re getting bit by you know other
insects and you know we got to figure out if this something that we can solve
for them so he goes into the history of what happened I said okay when did it
first happened you know I always I always go into history when did this
first occur when did this first happen when did you first have the encounter
with the insect he says well I went into the woods I went camping and I started
we started getting bitten by these flies I think they’re noseeums okay so you
know chances are you you could be getting you could have gotten camping
and you got bid by knows him and he says well I brought them home and they’re now
breeding in my house and I said well wait a minute that right there tells me
something else is going on because noseeums
she’s not gonna bring them home I mean you can see them on your skin their
visible fly and he had this encounter where he’s getting bit all weakened by
this and now he’s bringing him home so I said okay well there has to be something
else that’s not it is well I see him flying where I live well here here is
the problem you he does live in a lakefront area but you know now he sees
insects everywhere he had a traumatizing experience where he was getting bitten
all weekend by something and he comes home and now he’s getting bitten there’s
been happening now for okay and so I go I said okay let me stop
on in and let me see what we can find so we’re there and he’s has these
monitor he’s already put product he’s already fogged the house he’s already
gone through a certain amount of work trying to resolve this problem and it’s
been going on now for about six months their monitors everywhere and he says
well they’re there they’re in the monitors I can see them um I feel them
on my skin I was a matter of fact I’m talking to you right now and they’re
biting me and he lifts up his pants and he says ah right there on my calf
they’re biting me I can feel them okay so I’m looking at his calf and you know
he pulled up his panem looking at his calf and there’s nothing there I mean
nothing that I can see so I’m thinking okay maybe you know I you know who knows
what he has I mean he’s you know I’m scratching my head here and looking at
all this I’m looking at the monitors I look inside the monitors there’s nothing
there I mean if it was a no seeum you would see it in a monitor there’s no fee
he doesn’t have animals there’s no fleas nobody in his house is getting bitten
he’s got a little child that’s two years old his wife there’s the the cleaning
ladies there you have you been getting bit no has the child getting bit no is
the wife getting bit nobody is getting bit in this house except him and he’s
freaking out and I’m looking through all these monitors and with my lens and I’m
there looking all over the place inspecting you know you couldn’t you
know what could it possibly be that’s biting him and I find nothing and then
he says I’m already you know at work here’s the problem here here is the
worst part about this we couldn’t find anything he’s telling me it’s on his arm
he’s I can feel it right now on my arm now he works out and he looks like he
body builds and he’s in really good shape and he shaves his arms there’s
nothing crawling on that skin I can see skin perfectly there’s nothing there
he’s telling me at work that you know they basically he’s seen he works at a
hospital the guy is a medical professional he’s not a doctor but he’s
in the medical field and he’s had the dermatologist and the doctors look at
him they can’t find anything there are no bites by the way nobody feels the
insect biting him however there are no bites there’s no rash there is no damage
on the skin I said you know you’ve had it looked by a dermatologist there’s
nothing in this monitors I see nothing in your skin I don’t know what I’m
treating for and I can’t treat I mean as as a pest control professional we cannot
treat he’s already sprayed he’s already fogged he’s already put the bombs he’s
done everything to that home what are we gonna do and the problem that we have
when we run into a situation like this is that if you treat for something that
isn’t there can your state in the Department of Agriculture for treating a
nun sites pest or a pest that’s not there because a lot of states are site
states and a lot of states you have to have the pest present in order to treat
if you have no past present what are you treating for and have you treated you
have to put a pest down on the documentation and now you’re forging a
state document we then we get into this this gray area that once you treat
you’re on the hook with that client because he’s expecting a relief any and
if you don’t then what’s gonna happen if they give you a bad review like you
basically took advantage of them what if the person does have a medical condition
what if the person does have a psychiatric condition and you’re
treating their home when there’s no pest present
you know I had another one where the lady told me I got bedbugs you know I
got bedbugs I said okay you got bedbugs what have you done what I’ve been you
know spraying and I’ve been doing it’s always you know they’re always gonna try
to solve this problem first and they’ve tried everything and now they’re calling
a profession of the solvents okay well here’s the you know the issue with
bedbugs have you seen a bedbug and and this is another person that deals in the
medical profession she is a nurse that travels to people’s home elderly
and she takes care of the elderly and I said and I caught bedbugs from being and
it’s been treated but I’m still getting the bites and I said okay have you then
you call the company back that you don’t know what I’ve done it myself I’m trying
to solve this problem myself and I said that’s very dangerous now you have a
problem with a healthcare worker that got bedbugs and they’re getting bitten
and they’re still going back to other people’s home and they’re sitting on
people’s furniture this is how they get it they don’t understand protocol how
about going to people’s home and that’s another podcast for another day but what
what I’m asking her are diagnostic questions education she says I got this
you know I had to go to the doctor because I got a boil in my back and you
know I because I got an infection from you know the bed bug I said okay well
you probably got it from scratching but not from the bed bug but you could have
you know since I got all these bites all over my so Kay well you know before I go
out there before I look at this send me pictures of the bedbugs can you collect
them I says yeah they are there all over my bed and everywhere I collect them she
sends me pictures I can’t make out that any of these pictures are bedbugs at
least none of those pictures that you sent me our bed bugs I I need I need I
need you to send me pictures if you’ve got a sample of them and you collect
them they’re pretty large this is what they look I sent her a picture of what a
bed bug looks like I get a package in the mail about a week
later full of stuff and I look at this bag I put it under a microscope look at
everything that’s in there none of those are bedbugs you’ve got you know cloth
fibers and you have you know skin and hair and she’s sure that she’s getting
bit by these bedbugs I says have you ever seen a bed but has anybody ever
seen the bedbug done the inspection and we charge for bedbug inspection so I
tell the client listen we can go with it but that can take me an hour to you know
we’re gonna charge a minimum of 125 dollars to do an inspection because we
can’t just go over and spend an hour looking for something that probably
isn’t there and I need to know what we’re dealing with and that’s our you
know professional time so you know they don’t want to spend the money so I get a
picture of the boil and it turns out it’s in a private area of her back and
I’m like great now now I’m getting these pictures of where this stuff is and
there’s no bites but you know any case I ended up with this picture
and this is the problem people start sending you pictures of things and you
know that you’re probably not qualified to look at diagnose and and so you get
into all of these issues with this but the reality is she’s been dealing with
this for six months she’s afraid to tell her boss that she might have bedbugs
because she can get fired all of this is going on and nothing nobody can find
anything and this is where now you you run into this situation and there’s
nothing you can do for that person the problem that we have is there’s so many so many diseases so many medications
that people are on today that you don’t know if it’s an allergic reaction that
it’s a symptom of a side effect of the medication that they’re taking people
who are died Maddox who have you know the syndromes
and problems because of diabetes now one of this the disease is that it has been
confused with is Morgellons disease and I hope I’m pronouncing that right I’ve
got a good article by the way I’ve got a lot of great links to a lot of this
information because you’re gonna need I’m gonna put it in the podcast but
Morgellons disease is is something that has been going back all the way to 1674
when it was first encountered by it was a British doctor
Sir Thomas Brown in a letter he describes a skin disease in French
children he’s his his hairs which have most amused me have not been in the face
or head but in the back and not in men but children as long ago observes in the
edenia this temper of little children in in and I’m gonna mispronounce this city
and in its language och called the Morgellons so basically is the little
hairs that break out of the back of the skin and it believes it happens in
people and in it’s still not understood today there’s a great article by the
National Institute of Health the history of Morgellons disease from the allusion
to definition because it was perceived and these are actually what appear to be
our little fibers under the skin that are still not understood of how they’re
forming but they have to be diagnosed and they’re often misdiagnosed til this
day and there’s little fibers that just Kamel and you can see them under a
microscope in this document you can see them in in the in underneath a
microscope how these little if basically you know look like little hairs that are
growing underneath the skin and you can’t explain why to this day what is
causing that condition it could be in the psychiatric now there the clinical I
got it like three good articles in here that you really need to go look at
epidemiologic history logic and molecular features of unexplained their
map a–they in delusional infestation is the other article it tends one of the
things that they’ve discovered in this article it tends to be more common in
Caucasian people and it tends to occur more in women than in men the delusional
infestation about two to one compared to males it also happens in in more in
elderly women the delusional infestation and they’re the things they discuss in
the article and why you know it tends to be is a lot of older women you know have
you know it could have a mental illness associate it’s you know part of what’s
being manifested so again it’s a very touchy situation because you you you how
do you tell a customer I’m sorry it’s all in your head you’ve got to be very
tactful of this because they what they you know most of the time when I get to
call is I need you to believe me nobody believes me everybody thinks I’m
crazy I’m not crazy and even when they go and move and the the problem with
this is they’ll start taking furniture out of their house they’ll start taking
you know the carpeting out they’ll start ripping it out because David are
convinced that their home is infested they’ll set stuff on fire outside
because they believe their house is infested and they’re moving out of their
home and they’re moving in with their relatives and now it starts affecting
the entire family because they’re convinced they haven’t
in there talking 24/7 about this infestation that they have on their skin
and their relatives are telling them you need to see a doctor you need to see a
psychiatrist you need to see this you need to do that and they’re like I don’t
have a mental problem I don’t have a medical condition I’m convinced and
everything they see around them they go on the internet and they look up every
disc in disorder and every insect that could possibly bite them some people are
seeing the insects coming in and out of their skin they say I see them see them
do you see them they’re coming out of my skin I mean I’ve had one person stand
there and say I can feel it right now in my arm look at my arm look and I’m
looking at their arm this is a person who’s very young by the way this isn’t
in his early 30s telling me they see the insects crawling out and this is very
very you know damaging to their relationships with you know with their
spouses with their kids that are in the home there’s a big difference between an
infestation and a bite and a scab the problem is when you’re in the home you
can’t call something on a skin because there’s a mark there a bite and the
first thing that comes out of our mouth could be oh yeah that’s a bite well a
bite from what it is it a scab where they’ve been scratching and and it’s
looks like a bite and is it an actual infestation well there’s only two
insects that actually infest the skin there’s no other and there’s a lot of
things that the people saying well I’m infested my skin is infested with
bedbugs my skin is infested with ticks with mites
I have bird mites that have infested my skin all these insects could bite but
they’re not going to infest the skin they’re not gonna live
in your skin you know is it a a bacterial infection or is it an actual
infestation and when it comes to issues of the skin the problem that we have in
even in the in the professional medical field is the lack of entomological
knowledge and the lack of entomology chol knowledge that people have because
what they’re reading is mostly blogs by non-professionals if you look at the
pages that come up you’ll see a blog by an unprofessional person who has taken
it upon themselves to write a blog because they need to sell you know ads
and any when you read when you look at the blog there’s 15 I mean you can’t
read a blog anymore where there’s not 16 pieces of ads stuck in between every
other line that you’re reading and because of Adsense because everybody’s
going Adsense crazy and everybody’s become a blogger and
everybody become a writer with no real anthem illogical no I mean when you look
at what it takes for us to get an insect in the field that we’ve never seen bring
it back to our office put it under a microscope and start going through the
anatomy of that insect an understanding insect anatomy alone of understanding
under looking at the antennae and Counting segments on an antenna to
identify what the taxonomy is of that insect to even get close to figuring out
what species or what family it is in taxonomy when we have to take our most
pest control people I’ve never taken a taxonomy course I recommend you highly
take a taxonomy course you take a basic insect anatomy course and here is a
person who’s never done any of this and they’re going on the web and I Dean
they have in their home 99% of the time they’re wrong and I’m here you know I
had one this weekend just it wasn’t a person that was getting bent but we did
it and then we did a basically an initial in the home and they had roaches
and they we discovered that he had big had an ant and big had an ant
you know how it got in is very simple the cable guy drilled a hole through the
wall the cable was coming in there was a gap
nobody sealed it ever and they made a nest inside the wall through that cable
and basically you get the frass being kicked out so they’re thinking the
customer regionally thought they had termites and we go in there we look and
say we’re seeing all kinds of frass and we’re seeing American Roach poop s
Kerman you know droppings and we go back a week later there’s ants everywhere
dead we’re getting control come back a week later after that we’re getting
control and then we go this last time and the tech calls me and says hey when
you did this initial because I did the initial he did all the follow-ups on it
hey did you notice all the beetles and I said what beetles I said the closet
where this infestation was is full of beetles and I’m like great
well what beetle is a– I don’t know I’ve never seen this before I said okay
get a sample bring them in you know brings in a half a dozen beetles I
pulled that open I’m saying okay this is interesting
there was no beetles there before there’s frost coming out there’s no
France there’s no dead ants but there’s beetles now put it under a microscope
trying to ID this beetle well I know enough about insect identification I
start taking pictures of every body part with a microscope I mean Miley we’re
using a microscope to ID this insect and we don’t know what it is I’m getting
pictures of the antennae counting how many segments they in the antennae I’m
getting pictures of the body I’m getting pictures of the mouth the the mandibles
the anus the feet the legs everything to try to ID this insect I put it online
two guys which follow me on on on my Facebook page
who are pretty much as expert as you’re gonna get in identifying insects because
this is what they did for a living for like 30-something years apiece say well
it’s this it belongs to this family and I said okay great that gives me
something and then the other one says yep I agree and then he comes back this
wait a minute I forgot I Linden looked really good at those antennae it’s in
this family two experts who are experts looking at the evidence I provided had a
difference of opinion and yet you know they were actually right and when I
counted and I looked at it and then I went in and looked at it well the
difference between here’s the difference what is a dung beetle family pretty much
and then the other one is a confused flower beetle now that gives me two
different perspectives if you got a dung beetle outside the home being carried in
or if you have or whether this insect is now in the pantry somewhere and I got to
go look for it do you see the big problem of why insect identification is
so important because now you’re like you why are you spraying for whatever I
treat in front we could spray that house all we want and if we got a confus
flower beetle well chances are it’s in the flower somewhere if you got a dung
beetle what if the heck is a dung beetle doing in a residential environment I
mean think about that for a minute it matters to get a positive ID and if
we got nothing that we’re finding what are we treating for and are we being
negligent by treating because if we here’s the the good will intention of a
lot of technicians you want to help the person you’re thinking well why don’t I
just spray with water because I don’t have a placebo effect then they will
think that the problem got resolved here’s the problem if it’s in their head
and if it’s a dermatological problem a medical problem it’s not gonna go away they’ve had to treat people with this
with psychiatric medication and all of the sudden the insects went away they’re
no longer but you’re treating and you’re spring having a trying to get a placebo
effect and what you’re gonna end up doing is
that person is gonna be calling you every week saying I still have bugs
after you sprayed and worst of all that you go online and they give a negative
review and all the repercussions and then you know whatever it could happen
by the family cuz you charged them for a service that they didn’t need and you
took advantage of them and here you are trying to help you see how this could
all fall apart on you by dealing with this the the best thing
you could do is saying listen I can’t find anything be honest I can’t find
anything and you know recommend that they see a dermatologist it could be a
skin disorder people will most likely accept a medical disorder or a skin
disorder or something it could be a plant that they got a rash from and you
can tidy that then telling the person it’s in their head because that’s not
gonna go very well so what do people describe well they describe a process
known as formication now that is formication with an EM okay
not with an N so and this is described we get this from ants for fur Missy for
mr. da creeping or crawling sensation stinging and biting it’s a sensation
they get on their skin I had a friend of mine who is a diabetic who told me you
know called me once and says manna I’m getting bit in my in my unit he lives
alone he’s you know he’s in his 50s late 50s he lives alone he’s diabetic
and he’s having bite sensations man I spent an hour in his place tearing that
place apart looking for bedbugs looking through the mattress with a lens
every little speck that I found on his skin on his hands I show me where it’s
biting you in this I’ve got you know there’s no apparent rash there’s no
apparent bites but he’s having I said listen you you might need to go to a
doctor and make sure it isn’t you know from your diabetes that you’re feeling
this from from medication that you’re taking you know it’s happened several
times so is it you know that’s the sensation that they described so there
are no visible pass now what you got understand about Paz is
that there’s no such thing as an invisible past okay it’s an insect if
it’s a mite if it belongs in one of those two families they could be
microscopic but they’re not gonna be invisible you should be able to find
them a lot of the a lot of insects that bite like mosquitoes bed bugs ticks
fleas midges which are noseeums they’re mostly outdoor some spiders most
spiders are not gonna bite you if you don’t you know mess with them too
much in finding biting spiders is rare you know how many times have I seen a
person tell me well I got diagnosed by my doctor that I got bitten by a brown
recluse spider I said did you ever find the brown recluse spider no how does
your doctor know that you got a brown recluse spider well he says it was he’s
a medical doctor and see the problem is there’s no brown recluse spiders in
Florida at least not in South Florida and she lives down here and she hasn’t
traveled outside of the US you know I mean I ask people all the time have you
been traveling where did you go where have you been because I need to know if
they you know got bit somewhere else and they’re still just getting the skin
reaction now from someplace that they were um you know we got mites that
attack humans I mean I’ve gotten bitten by bird mites
there’s rodent mites I had a situation just a couple of months ago where a
family is calling me saying their children are getting bitten in a
bedroom and this is a mobile home and I’m saying okay great you know probably
got fleas you know the underneath cats go underneath and you know rats and all
that and you get fleas and this says no there’s no fleas I don’t have any pets I
go in and I said where are they getting better well it’s only the girls that are
getting bitten okay well let’s go to the girls room and take a look and sure
enough I said you know look at her arm she’s got all these little tiny bites
and I said yep that looks like you know could be bites so where are they getting
the only here okay so I go to the route I go outside
sure enough in that corner of that bedroom in the soffit there was a bird’s
nest in there and that burst nests was huge I mean it took about three feet one
way and three feet the other there were birds living in there and so we had to
take that nest out once you take the nest I’ll you know basically we spray
that area with a 25 B product to get a quick knockdown and basically once you
get rid of the birds nests and you get rid of the site you know these guys will
die because they can’t live off of humans so it was a temporary situation
it doesn’t happen that’s been going on for weeks since they moved in because
that bird nest has been there forever so there were mites in there but once we
got rid of the bird nest we took it out you know I mean it filled up almost a a
13 gallon bag of of completely I mean it was a big nest but that’s it you know so
things like that can’t happen you know then you got scabies scabies mites they
can burrow into the skin however they can’t you know live there I mean you’re
not gonna get that infestation it does have itching and rash there is but it’s
a medical problem it needs to be taken care of by a medical doctor you can’t
treat the skin for for scabies mites they’re there there is you know chiggers
well you know it’s it’s it’s the larvae of a harvest mite it doesn’t happen in
the winter they’re mostly outdoor they don’t infest homes so people say you
know I’ve got chiggers in my home you know you went by it you know you walked
I had a guy tell me one so I found out what was happening to my skin as
chiggers you know I said you know did a doctor diagnosed that and he says nobody
says you don’t live you live in a condo you don’t go through the woods you know
if you bathe yourself and you know you can pretty much get rid of it with soap
and water and they’re so small that you know you really can’t be seen so I don’t
think you have sugars you really need to go to a doctor and have them ID that and
then you have finally lice you know head lice body lice pubic lice
this happens because somebody had close personal contact with somebody else they
slept in the wrong place with the wrong person
you know bedding toilet seats undergarments but this is not a
pest-control function you can’t treat a person for head lice you can’t treat
them for body lice a doctor has to do that a dermatologist has to do that
these are things that are outside of our expertise you know complications from
medication you know psychiatric depression schizophrenia dimension these
are medical conditions we can’t treat this diabetes jaundice can cause skin
you know certain cancers can cause itching drug use here’s here’s a big one
cocaine and amphetamine use people being on meth you know cops report this all
the time people are saying that bugs aren’t all crawling all over them while
they’re under the influence of drugs some NSAIDs steroids can cause these
problems it requires a physical exam by a doctor do not by any means go
examining people’s body you know looking for stuff that’s not something you can
really do that could cause some serious problem and some serious liabilities
later on especially if the person does have a mental disorder and then starts
accusing you of something else do you see the problem we’re trying to help
people we’re trying to do the right thing and by doing the right thing you
know it didn’t bites you in the butt and and you need to take precautions you’re
going in at home hey you know you might need to to take precautions also on what
you wear you got a look at PPE pee pee that’s not a label when you’re not
treating stuff I mean what PPE is on an inspection report that you’re going into
homes to do certain inspections you know I mean I if I’m gonna do a fleet job and
it’s bad and the person’s telling me they’re getting bit and bad you know I’m
using a Tyvek suit with booties you know I’m not you know I’ve had one guy walk
into a room where they had the key was a pool house and they were allowing all
the cats from the neighborhood to come in and feed and they had put the food
inside and my guy walks in there and he starts screaming like you could act and
what happened he says they’re biting me all over he walks out of there you know
he’s got covered in fleas you know these are the things that you know you don’t
get prepared for in in pest control training but this is the stuff that
needs to be discussed the training that needs to happen on how you properly deal
with this and I hope that this podcast helps a lot of you who have never done
this to understand that you have to search for an insect if there isn’t an
insect there’s nothing for you to treat that you don’t go treating something
that isn’t there to try to help people because you think if you do it and it’s
gonna have a placebo effect they’re gonna be satisfied they’re gonna be
happy and 99 percent of the time that is not the case it actually gets worse so
you know look at all this look at the information read the links that I put
there there these are darn good articles scientific articles on a lot of this to
make you sharp you know I can’t go into all that in detail because that would
take repot cast just to go through all that
literature but read the links I’m gonna put them in there
follow along we’re gonna put this up today hopefully and and you’ll be able
to get all this information you need to start preparing yourself if you’ve never
encountered this to deal with this and until next time you guys have a piss
tacular day thank you for listening to the best geek podcast if you have
enjoyed the past two podcast please give us a rating you write a review or
subscribe to the channel you can join the pesky society by visiting pesky
podcast.com thank you for listening see you next time you

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